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Post by ironcladtrash on Jul 17, 2012 19:57:50 GMT -5
To many themes are still unexplored. U should start deck building with the question: How do I win my games, and not with, how I deal with counters I dont think everything has been explored yet either. This is why I am not ready to say one way or another if this new expansion is worse or better. Most of the deck ideas I wanted to build and tried before the expansion didn't work. But it was fun playing until I could fine tune the deck to make it better. That hasn't changed for me now. I saw a lot of people playing similar decks before the expansion and same is true now. I think there is almost always ways to make whatever idea any one has for a deck more competitive. I think we just need a little longer to figure out how. |
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Post by Tuism on Jul 18, 2012 4:31:34 GMT -5
Well I've been doing some hardcore exploration, dominant, deceptive, etc, but it always seem to boil down to - all my key cards are getting countered, or all my cards are getting countered. I know about packing more threats than people can counter, but either there arent enough variety of cards to support a theme or then they're taken out by Suleimans (suleimen?). Then I try other things, then I find them inferior to stronghold and other surprises.
That's the typical exploration experience. Really, I've tried to be creative. I guess I just need more time.
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Post by The Rancord on Jul 18, 2012 4:52:16 GMT -5
well deceptive sites, id start with next site is a surprise gminango. U can trigger next site is a surprise at beginning of the game, but use it later.
Id use it in crime faith, to use the crime sites as answers against rush or so. And Also then he cannot use sulejman on the sites. With Holy day u got good boost and see how many counter he has. Romani camp for deceptive or hagia sophia. Some Yerteban to defend from san polo or evil things, 3 of the 1 cost discarders. Or u could use the 11 cost site with the 1 / +2 discard to give a kickstart, and soon u are at a reasonable deck that can be tested.
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Post by ericluah on Jul 18, 2012 5:20:30 GMT -5
Well I've been doing some hardcore exploration, dominant, deceptive, etc, but it always seem to boil down to - all my key cards are getting countered, or all my cards are getting countered. I know about packing more threats than people can counter, but either there arent enough variety of cards to support a theme or then they're taken out by Suleimans (suleimen?). Then I try other things, then I find them inferior to stronghold and other surprises. That's the typical exploration experience. Really, I've tried to be creative. I guess I just need more time. Pretty much need to factor in either piri or the Constanpine site in most decks. Plenty of counters in the current meta. A counter deck is probably the cheapest and strongest deck ATM. Which I suspect is also why they included cards which allow us to cast our actions/sites/agents as surprises. Incidentally everyone packing piri and constapine would force the heavy counters to fit in removal cards. Which reduces the number of counters they have. I also felt extreme fustration initially, I ended up playing 5 piri 5 comstapine sites in my deck, but that screwed me up when I played against other decks. Surprise sites so far are still in my opinion the most overpowered ATM. As it is impossible to stop them from scoring unless you are playing sites yourself and have stuff on the table. Piri being 2/1 makes him more balanced. I think if anything needs to be done to suleiman, it would be to make him 2/1 like piri. |
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Post by The Rancord on Jul 18, 2012 5:35:28 GMT -5
Pretty much need to factor in either piri or the Constanpine site in most decks. Im doing very well without any of those cards. I still think that sulejman could need a tweak, but I do not understand the mind set of: play counter or anti counter. Yesterday I lost with a counter deck to a discard/shaku/odaj deck, that was very innoative. no constantinople/no piri, and still owned my counter deck. |
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Post by ericluah on Jul 18, 2012 5:42:16 GMT -5
Pretty much need to factor in either piri or the Constanpine site in most decks. Im doing very well without any of those cards. I still think that sulejman could need a tweak, but I do not understand the mind set of: play counter or anti counter. Yesterday I lost with a counter deck to a discard/shaku/odaj deck, that was very innoative. no constantinople/no piri, and still owned my counter deck. Suleiman just needs to be 2/1 like mysterious stranger. |
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Post by ericluah on Jul 18, 2012 5:47:29 GMT -5
Pretty much need to factor in either piri or the Constanpine site in most decks. Im doing very well without any of those cards. I still think that sulejman could need a tweak, but I do not understand the mind set of: play counter or anti counter. Yesterday I lost with a counter deck to a discard/shaku/odaj deck, that was very innoative. no constantinople/no piri, and still owned my counter deck. Against counter decks, u need to be able to drop a big enough threat on the table early or drop 2 at the same time, as they usually don't have enough income to counter 2 within a day. |
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Post by Tuism on Jul 18, 2012 5:52:23 GMT -5
Im doing very well without any of those cards. I still think that sulejman could need a tweak, but I do not understand the mind set of: play counter or anti counter. Yesterday I lost with a counter deck to a discard/shaku/odaj deck, that was very innoative. no constantinople/no piri, and still owned my counter deck. Suleiman just needs to be 2/1 like mysterious stranger. 1/2 please. He shouldn't be an offensive factor. |
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Post by The Rancord on Jul 18, 2012 5:55:59 GMT -5
btw constantinople doesnt stop guard duty, right? Of u play cards that cant be countered. In any crime deck, u could allways have backup solution of 5 assassin strongholds, should ure enemy rely on only countering. Then u stop playing other cards.  |
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Post by Tuism on Jul 18, 2012 6:04:12 GMT -5
But that was my point damnit, you have to play counters or anti counters, and that leaves all the other strategies and cards kinda pointless. I love the stronghold and ezio mentor but they're effing overpowered (stronghold is anyway, mentors not that bad).
I want me some more variety man... Viable variety.
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Post by ericluah on Jul 18, 2012 6:16:06 GMT -5
But that was my point damnit, you have to play counters or anti counters, and that leaves all the other strategies and cards kinda pointless. I love the stronghold and ezio mentor but they're effing overpowered (stronghold is anyway, mentors not that bad). I want me some more variety man... Viable variety. Piri isn't just about counters. Piri is affective against over about 1/4 of the current popular cards that you find in most decks. it's more of the current meta having lotsa of surprises. I agree Stronghold needs to be nerfed though. |
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Post by Blind_Angel_(Juelette) on Jul 18, 2012 6:47:47 GMT -5
Usual tipes in CCG is rush-control-combo like scissors-paper-stone.
I asked here recently, what is RUSH in ACR? Noone can answer.
If we can exclude rush, we have control and combo tipes.
And you all say the way it is.
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Post by lurifaxb on Jul 18, 2012 7:30:43 GMT -5
Rush is when you bring all you have early for a quick win. Usually that means agent rush. A common agent rush is cheap militant that gets buffed really quickly. Thieves and nobel can also have rush elements.
Rush decks are strong early but lack counters and defense, thus er weak mid/late game.
We are starting to see some good agent rush decks. Take a look at Brontos militant rush deck for a good example.
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Post by Blind_Angel_(Juelette) on Jul 18, 2012 7:46:13 GMT -5
bla bla bla.... you say we have rush decks, well then we have no problem mentioned above this topic  |
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Post by Brontobeuf on Jul 18, 2012 10:03:21 GMT -5
Tuism... there will always be stronger cards than others. There will always be meta-defining cards and their counters that you will have to include in your decks if you want themto be competitive.
The problem with the game is not the counters. It's not the lack of diversity (and I don't even think this exists). It's not the lack of nerfs or buffs.
It's the lack of organised play.
Once implemented, organised play should stimulate the meta enough so that real good and orignals decks will emerge. And if 2 or 3 counter decks arrive in finals, well only then we may think they are too strong. And if only 3 or 4 different decks are played in the tournaments, then only we will say that this game lacks of diversity.
Until then, we're just here to get as much fun as we can while gathering our free 500 credits per day. :]
To be honest (and I don't want to sound agressive because I'm not. I'm only love) I'm a bit bored by the current bandwagon taken by this forum's users saying that Revelation is only counters and anti-counters, and that it suxx. I'd prefer talk about deck lists.
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