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Post by shadire on Jan 16, 2013 5:39:43 GMT -5
Hello fellow gamers! I have just discovered this neat game few days ago and found it really addictive. I built a deck for competitive matches that nets me ca. 70% win ratio. I believe it can fare much better and so I am here asking for some advice. Why militant rush? I found it to be extremely cheap to build such a deck. Even more so that I had particular luck for rare media cards in my templar boosters so far. - 5 Persistant Handlers - 5 Militant Militia - 5 City Official - 5 Cahin - 5 Micheletto Corella - 5 Silvestro Sabbatini - 5 Basilica di San Marco -5 Tactless Theater - 5 Papal Influence -5 Magnetic Personality - 5 A call to Action - 2 Man of the People - 2 Carnivale - 1 Calling all Stand-ins -5 Brothers in Arms The big question is - is it possible to improve this deck siginificantly within 5k budget or is it better to spend these credits on a better cheap deck, e.g. this one: acreedrecollection.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=lowb&action=display&thread=1823(as order rush have many ways to get safety that make them much better at countering neutralization and threat). So far I found 2 strategies I have problems countering with my deck: 1) Very vulnerable against crime rush. If opp manages to get Lanz/Volpe or smth similar early on in his hand, then I can do nothing, neither outrush him nor block (sacrificing 1/1 agents on Lanzes will just put me at severe card disadvantage before I can rush successfully) Fixed with Tactless Theater 2) Quite vulnerable against decks with mass neutralization (usually wrath of the righteous). Sometimes I manage to rush fast enough but if enemy combines wrath with some good control cards and spams discards, I cannot do much. |
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Joek
Full Member
Also known as Ephemerial
Posts: 239
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Post by Joek on Jan 16, 2013 9:53:21 GMT -5
Use Tactless Theatrics when dealing with Thief rushes. Answered Prayers can be used to remove specific threats (Wrath of the Righteous/Lassitude/Wanted Poster) from your opponent's hand. These two memories both generate income.
Caha, Shahkulu, and Odai are useful higher-cost militants. However, since you want pure rush, they won't help nearly as much here.
Clothes Make the Man is useful for copying opponent cards, as well as your own. Combine CMtM with Papal Influence for 9 cost 10 influence gained. That's a full region, and a huge advantage.
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Post by coolkendude on Jan 16, 2013 10:40:20 GMT -5
You might also want to include Bearer of Mixed Tiding for draw power seeing the number of agents you deploy. I'm not sure how much it costs nowadays but I don't remember it being an expensive card.
Brothers in Arms (+1/+0 to all agents) might also help you out early on.
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Post by shadire on Jan 16, 2013 13:39:04 GMT -5
Use Tactless Theatrics when dealing with Thief rushes. Answered Prayers can be used to remove specific threats (Wrath of the Righteous/Lassitude/Wanted Poster) from your opponent's hand. These two memories both generate income. Swapped Basilica di San Marco for Tactless Theatrics. I have no idea how I could overlook TT! It's cheap, provides much needed income and is solution for most of my problems with threat. Not to mention that during early game rush is all about it can get rid of like 75% agents. Tried this and works like a charm, providing second breath with these crime rushes, usually allowing to win. Thanks for the tip! Also Basilica proved to be too slow so far. Even though its concept fit good, it never seemed to make any substantial difference. Agents synergize between one another much better, especially if there is Sabbattini in hand also costing 4. As for Answered Prayers, I think it would be too occassinal to take precious place in a deck. I think it is more important to guarntee consistency and stability when it comes to successful rush strategy. Caha, Shahkulu, and Odai are useful higher-cost militants. However, since you want pure rush, they won't help nearly as much here. Agreed. They do not seem well suited for rushing. Maybe Shahkulu but I will stick to Sabbattinis. They are cheaper and more formidable foe alone. Clothes Make the Man is useful for copying opponent cards, as well as your own. Combine CMtM with Papal Influence for 9 cost 10 influence gained. That's a full region, and a huge advantage. Hmm, sounds fine. Papal Influence really screws these players without proper counters, it won me a lot of games. Might be good to have more of it than 5, not to mention ability to copy some nice enemy buffs that could also turn the tide. You might also want to include Bearer of Mixed Tiding for draw power seeing the number of agents you deploy. I'm not sure how much it costs nowadays but I don't remember it being an expensive card. Brothers in Arms (+1/+0 to all agents) might also help you out early on. I don't feel like Bearer of Mixed Tidings could help me much. If I really need drawing power with my deck it usually means that my agents already got obliterated somehow. And that means BoMT is useless too. Brother in Arms is more reasonable. Only problem with it is that I have no idea what should I drop to get it in? Thanks for all the responses so far! |
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Post by Rob (Roebidoebi) on Jan 17, 2013 8:47:00 GMT -5
A Media rush deck without Magnetic Personality? Is that even possible? I would use MP instead of Papal Influence...
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Post by kackman73 on Jan 17, 2013 13:48:55 GMT -5
A Media rush deck without Magnetic Personality? Is that even possible? I would use MP instead of Papal Influence... I had the same thought, but the OP did mention that he (?) was trying to create an inexpensive deck, and seems to be buying mostly Templar Boosters. While MagPers doesn't go for as much as an Ezio Mentor on the market, it's also not dirt cheap. |
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Post by shadire on Jan 17, 2013 17:33:40 GMT -5
I had the same thought, but the OP did mention that he (?) was trying to create an inexpensive deck, and seems to be buying mostly Templar Boosters. Indeed - he intended to create a cheap deck for fast matches. MP seemed a bit costly for 2k a stack but I just acquired it to test it out due to strong recommendation. Obviously fares better than Papal Influence. At the moment it seems that only decks with wrath (combined with good income generation and drawing power to launch it fast enough) make me at a serious disadvantage. Any other tips against this one? Answered Prayers are IMO unreliable at best. Also, since now it is pure Media deck, I would greatly appreciate any suggestions about adding most beneficial cards from any other expertise. |
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Joek
Full Member
Also known as Ephemerial
Posts: 239
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Post by Joek on Jan 17, 2013 18:19:23 GMT -5
Anti-Wrath?
Losing Faith (Erase), Evasive Manuevers/Dante (Safe), Counters/SE (although it won't work against surprise), discard (7 cost should be one of the first to get discarded) or selective discard... Perfectly timed brilliant buglaries are a (crazy) option.
I recommend Hippodrome for more staying power, but it's a late game card, so it may not be useful.
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Post by ironcladtrash on Jan 17, 2013 19:06:56 GMT -5
I recommend Hippodrome for more staying power, but it's a late game card, so it may not be useful. I have been using Role Reversal recently just for that reason and that card over Easy Come Easy go because it has surprise. Role Reversal might be a good fit in this deck. |
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Post by lurifaxb on Jan 18, 2013 11:15:42 GMT -5
Hi Shadire. We just played today. I wanted to test the speed of your deck vs my old noble rush deck. You may have had a bad draw, but speed seems to be the issue. I would add at least 5 pure income cards if you have them. Dama Rosa is the best right now. If you don't have it I would use 5x merchant ships.
Also, I would definitely use shakula (spelling?) and less Caha / 2-3. I would prefer a deck with some expensive boosters like shakula and then mass deploy inexpensive agents. Micheletto is good but too expensive and slows you more down.
Also use 5x of the tutor card for militants, selling dreams, will make sure you have city official or shakula early. Otherwise your weak agents will stay weak if deployed without them first.
Edit:
Oh, and if you can play another faction, order has a great card for rush buildup. Borgia Towers. They will fit nicely here. Also gives income.
I would not use militant militia. Rather belligerent ottoman militia. Cost 0. More speed.
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Post by shadire on Jan 20, 2013 16:14:02 GMT -5
Hello there, indeed my hand and draw when playing with you was far from optimal. The very next game I won easily against another noble rush, just they did not have Selims, making it more predictible to battle agents against.
Anyway you provided a lot of food for thought for me. I experimented with my deck a bit and finally got something that is both exciting to play and wins consistently +90% of matches.
Just got to season top 25 with this.
Here it is, ordered somewhat by card importance:
Key cards (pumping up agents):
- 5 Shahkulu
- 5 City Official
- 5 Borgia Tower (least important here but if opp manages to counter your stronger agents, that's the way to go with weak ones)
Safemaker:
- 5 Dante Moro
Drawing power:
- 5 Bearer of Mixed Tidings
Consistency:
- 5 Selling Dreams
Fast agents (aka fast pumping up):
- 5 Cahin
- 5 Call to Arms
- 5 Persistent Panhandler
Surprise win condition:
- 5 Magnetic Personality
Agents counter / finisher:
- 5 Tactless Theatrics
Late game beef:
- 2 Caha
***
So basically I adjusted according to your suggestions, Lurifaxb.
One thing I changed that has major impact is swapping Dama Rossa with Dante. My deck is vulnerable to key agent counters. With Dantes help however, my pumping chain becomes nigh impossible to stop. Plus it makes countering threat even easier, making Tactless Theatrics a possible swap or deck size reduction.
After some time playing I also found BoMT indispensible as card advantage is crucial even in a rush. Makes it way safer if opp somehow neutralizes my first chain of key agents.
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Post by lurifaxb on Jan 21, 2013 5:55:18 GMT -5
That looks like a very powerful deck - and fun. Will give it a try when I have the chance.
Dante is a good call. Especially since you can use him twice and kill him off, leaving room for militants.
I think all that is left is minor tweeking based on how it plays. You can tweek the amount of Dante, Borgia Towers and Tactless Theatrics. Some situations a counter or a kill card (erase agent or kill sites) may be more beneficial. I could imagine with the great draw power, you would have several cards in hand that you can't use. If you have 6x buffed up militants, the other militant in hand are just backups.
For instance, Dante does not protect from erase effects, stealing or returning to hand. A counter in hand would be better. In that situation.
Some deceptive site rushes may also out pace you with no anti site cards.
Depending on how well it draws, you could use Masyaf for some of the draw power. It consistently makes you draw and it forces opponent to fight (and die). If you have one of them, try replacing a Borgia tower with it and see how it does - compared to having a Borgia tower.
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Post by lurifaxb on Jan 23, 2013 14:12:05 GMT -5
For a budget deck it is good. But with the time I played it is sure wasn't a 90% win deck. More like 50-60% in my hands. The income build up is a bit slow for consistency. A good draw is essential.
But when it takes off it is really great. Fun to see your agents get buffed up in no time.
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Post by shadire on Jan 23, 2013 14:47:10 GMT -5
For a budget deck it is good. But with the time I played it is sure wasn't a 90% win deck. More like 50-60% in my hands. The income build up is a bit slow for consistency. A good draw is essential. But when it takes off it is really great. Fun to see your agents get buffed up in no time. You would surely get much better results if you got a better feel of it over time. Income is slow indeed, I experimented with adding some Dama Rossa and it might play even better. However your pretty low 50-60% win ratio might stem from the fact that you played it like a typical rush. While in fact it is not. What I do most of the time is launching income cards first (Dantes, Borgias, occassinal Panhandler) and trying to bait enemy into countering less important / cheaper agents (Dante, City Official). The idea is not to rush but to make sure you will have at least 1 Shahkulu + 1 City Official combo on board and some fast agents to build up stacks immediately afterwards (Cahins+Call to Actions). This makes you win within 1-2 days easily and unexpectedly (MagPer might become pretty essential at this stage unless you already swept enemy agents). It surely takes some time to assess whether it is better to just launch weaker agents early to buff them with Borgia, or to block with them and possibly get some card advantage with your surprise buffs, or to disrupt enemy with TT and prepare good hand with Selling Dreams or to launch most powerful agents asap. That's what I find most fun about it - there are couple strategies for building up power here and it is easy to surprise enemy. It is also essential to assess what is a good drawing hand. I find it that it should be as close as possible to this: 1 Dama Rossa / Dante Moro 1 Borgia Tower 1 Cahin / Call to Action 1 City Official / Shahkulu 1 Selling Dreams 1 Bearer of Mixed Tidings This leaves you with the most options to begin with. Early income is more important than stronger cards though. And in fact as long as you have at least 1 Selling Dreams you can pretty much substitute any militant from the list for anything else and it still will be pretty optimal. |
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Post by kackman73 on Jan 23, 2013 16:11:25 GMT -5
How many days does it typically take you to get your Shakulu and City Official on the board? If income generation is as slow as it seems, I'd imagine that a lot of agent removal/nullification decks would be well able to handle your militants by then.
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